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Scholar
#2101 Old 2nd Dec 2021 at 2:16 PM
Sims 4 is not that bad. I just decided to try TS4 with Cottage Living. And I feel obsessed. I am very excited with that only EP.

Here you can see more of my creations and conversions for sims 3. ;) I`ll glad to see your comments in.
Theorist
#2102 Old 2nd Dec 2021 at 3:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
Waste of money? ...and it will cost you an arm and a leg. Literally. Over and over again.

But - have fun


I would have no intention of buying it retail, which is another reason why this is not on my immediate horizon. I didn't get into TS2 until 2012, when I got the whole shebang for about $100. So TS4 is a few years off for me. I'm actually hoping EA comes out with TS5, because that would likely drop the price for TS4 dramatically.

I'm curious, though, by your virulent reaction against TS4 every time the subject comes up. Have you actually played the game?
Mad Poster
#2103 Old 2nd Dec 2021 at 4:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaryRob
Have you actually played the game?

No. I haven't played it. I refuse to play a game that I don't actually own (that is on-line only, and subject to updates that totally wipe out all your customization.)
I'm way to Scotch for that!

Please ~ support my TS2 habit! Shop at my Etsy shops:
CatherinesJewelry ~ Artisan Jewelry
Catherine's MOUSE ~ Up/Recycled Jewelry
and Vintage Stuffeths
Scholar
#2104 Old 2nd Dec 2021 at 7:51 PM Last edited by Victor_tor : 3rd Dec 2021 at 7:46 AM. Reason: UPD
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
I refuse to play a game that I don't actually own

But... how come you are playing UC then. It was also shared just with digital copy Or... are you refuse to play illegal copy of that game (downloaded from torrents or somethin) that you don't really own?

Just not to go way too off topic I decided to share this "my own design" created in the Sims 4 Cottage Living with a little story. Yeah I decided to take another chance to Sims 4.



UPD: ouch! They updated the game again

Here you can see more of my creations and conversions for sims 3. ;) I`ll glad to see your comments in.
Theorist
#2105 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 2:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
No. I haven't played it. I refuse to play a game that I don't actually own (that is on-line only, and subject to updates that totally wipe out all your customization.)


If you don't own and have never played the game, how do you know it does all that? Seriously, I'm not trying to be a smartass, but how do you know to what extent it does those things? Do you know someone who has the game, or are you getting your info from what you read online?

(As an aside, while I understand what you mean by owning a game and agree with your sentiment, in actuality whenever you buy just about any computer game you're really just buying a license to use it. Anything created for the game is actually legally owned by the developer/publisher.
This is why all this business at various Sims websites, including MTS, about people's "policies", is all nonsensical and actually quite illegal, because none of us so-called creators have any legal copyrights over the things we create. Only Electronic Arts has those rights. When we upload our creations we are essentially putting our creations into the public domain, for anyone to do with as they please. We cannot legally stipulate how other players use our creations, whether they can make changes to our creations, whether they can or cannot upload them to certain other websites, etc., etc., it's all nonsense with no legal basis.
The idea that third-party creators such as us can assert copyrights over our creations is something that was started by a small group of people who want to use the Sims franchise to further their narrow social and political agendas. Gullible people who spend countless hours creating things for the game are taken in by this false notion and think that they actually have copyright control over what they create. Sorry, but that's just not the case.
In my opinion, Electronic Arts should have been sued years ago in a class action for allowing this practice to take place, because when a person buys a Sims game they do so with the expectation that they can freely share and use other people's creations, without a third party placing limitations on the free exchange of content. The fact that EA has allowed the practice to continue tells me that they support the agendas being pushed by a certain segment of society.)
Mad Poster
#2106 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 4:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor_tor
UPD: ouch! They updated the game again

That. ^^^ Right there. ^ That's what I'm talking about.
I own the UC (I have all the discs, and got it for free when Origin released it) And, it is downloaded and completely stored on my HD. I do not "phone-home" to origin to play. Origin has no idea if I'm playing it or not. There is no on-line connection involved.
My Dragon Ages are set up the same way - with the exception of DA Inquisition, because it has an optional multi-player game (that no one plays anymore) but, because of this, it must "phone-home" every time I play it. So, for DAI, I make sure all my "saves" are stored on my machine and not in the cloud. My stuff is MY stuff!
Does that make sense?

Your house looks really sweet though, Vic. I love all the animals .

ScaryRob - My issue has nothing to do with copyright stuff. That's not what I mean; my issue is that they can "update the game" and completely mess up the way you have things set up in it.
Yes, I know they do this - I have a lot of friends who play TS4. Vic just experienced it above! My information comes from them.

When I buy something, it is now mine, and I can do whatever I want to with it (within the law.)
I buy my own house/property - I can plant or build whatever I want. (I can't grow plants that are against the law, obvi: and I must follow zoning regulations.)
I buy my own food - I can cook/eat it however I want. I can even put mustard on my grapefruit and it eat, if I want to.
I buy my own toys - I can play them how I want to. If my Ken doll wants to wear Barbie's clothes, I can decide if he will or won't.
My game. My way.
Things that are not fully owned by me, I stay away from. I don't even like public libraries - if I enjoy the book I've read, I go by a copy (so I can read it again.)
If I were to buy-in to a co-op, or an HOA, or something else that had multiple owners, I would have to think long and hard about joining. And, I would probably decide against it.

Do I like Microsoft? No, I do not. But, I am choosing to use their products (mainly so I can play my games - which are tedious to set up on Linux.)

As an artist, one of the hardest/toughest lessons I had to learn was: once I sell a piece of my art to someone else, it is theirs to do with as they want.
They can even take apart my creation and reuse the materials for something else. It is no longer mine.

...Thanks for letting me rant

Please ~ support my TS2 habit! Shop at my Etsy shops:
CatherinesJewelry ~ Artisan Jewelry
Catherine's MOUSE ~ Up/Recycled Jewelry
and Vintage Stuffeths
Scholar
#2107 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 4:52 PM Last edited by Victor_tor : 3rd Dec 2021 at 5:27 PM. Reason: Answer for Catherine
Scaryrob, EA, when it was once Maxis, was very much into creation for the Sims. The Sims founder Will Write was also into creativity and this policy still lasts through decades. That's why we still has Exchanges supported by EA.

Similar example. You can have full time job and have money from boss and that's your duty. But bosses allow you to have labour unions on your workplace (excluding some certain sutuations when you sign a document tells that you can't) Simply said: EA is a boss and we are labour union members.

Situation is almost the same and same way as job boss, EA has no right to stop actions of simmers community until it will start to contradict with EA license. And guidelines set by this community are set by its community, the same way as with labour unions, and can not interrupted by others but by its own moderators.

The sign on the bottom of this site telling This site is not endorsed by or affiliated with Electronic Arts, or its licensors. Trademarks are the property of their respective owners. is true. Game content and materials are copyrighted by Electronic Arts. But fruit of our labour are still ours. And no one can grab it or claim as their own!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
I own the UC (I have all the discs, and got it for free when Origin released it) And, it is downloaded and completely stored on my HD.

Ha! You are such a tough landlord, Cat XD I had not idea there was any way to download it comepletely to my HD. There would be good opportunity.
I understand your idea not to mess with third parties but I am not into that. I am ok with rent stuff. That's why I am fine to have Origin and have UC in there. I own much important stuff in real life than... games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
Your house looks really sweet though, Vic. I love all the animals .

Thanks ^_^ That's EA's property. I did not move there any walls

Here you can see more of my creations and conversions for sims 3. ;) I`ll glad to see your comments in.
Theorist
#2108 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 6:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatherineTCJD
My issue has nothing to do with copyright stuff.

I know it doesn't, and I feel the same way. I also have never played or "owned" a game that needed to periodically "phone home", or every time I played it.
I mentioned the copyrights issue only because even with games that you actually "own", you still only "own" by license and that everything you or any other third party makes for the game remains copyrighted to the developer/publisher. If a game allows custom content to be created for it, players who create such custom content have no legal right to limit other players' use of their creations. This has been the case with every computer game I have ever owned/played and it is the industry standard.

Quote:
When I buy something, it is now mine, and I can do whatever I want to with it (within the law.)

Yes, and I'm glad that you included the phrase "within the law", because it is NOT within the law for third party creators such as us to limit how other players use our creations because we DO NOT own the copyrights to those creations, only EA does.
This is why all of these "Policies" that players have at most Sims websites are quite absurd and nonsensical. It may very well be that websites ostensibly allow players to have these "Policies", but they are legally unenforceable. For example, if I download something from a "creator" at MTS, I can do whatever I want with it, regardless of that person's "Policy", because he/she does have legal rights to the creation, only EA does. This is the point that sticks in so many people's craw, because they are under the false belief that just because they spent countless hours creating something that they are then entitled to exercise copyright control over the item, which simply is not the case.
People in this so-called "Sims Community" really need to familiarize themselves with the concept of "Labor of Love", because that is what all of our creations are, nothing more.

Quote:
Do I like Microsoft? No, I do not. But, I am choosing to use their products (mainly so I can play my games - which are tedious to set up on Linux.)

You, me, and probably millions of other people around the world, haha.
Theorist
#2109 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 7:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor_tor
Similar example. You can have full time job and have money from boss and that's your duty. But bosses allow you to have labour unions on your workplace (excluding some certain sutuations when you sign a document tells that you can't) Simply said: EA is a boss and we are labour union members.

That's not an accurate analogy and has nothing to do with the point I made.

Quote:
Situation is almost the same and same way as job boss, EA has no right to stop actions of simmers community until it will start to contradict with EA license. And guidelines set by this community are set by its community, the same way as with labour unions, and can not interrupted by others but by its own moderators.

EA most certainly has a right to stop the actions of simmers or websites FOR ANY REASON, if they so chose. They OWN everything made for the Sims franchise and have sole discretion on the use of any items made for the game. I don't know why this is so hard for some people to understand.

Now, let me give you an example. There is a Sims website called SexySims, maybe you've heard of it. This is a website (supposedly maintained by the same people who maintain MTS) where you can download anatomically correct (naked, without pixellation) Sims, from what I understand. And probably other "adult" stuff too. If EA thought that this website would bring disrepute to their game, they could tell the owners of the site to Cease and Desist and shut the site down.

Quote:
The sign on the bottom of this site telling This site is not endorsed by or affiliated with Electronic Arts, or its licensors. Trademarks are the property of their respective owners. is true.

This statement has nothing to do with players (third party creators) of the game. Players (third party creators) are not the licensors referred to and players (third party creators) hold no trademarks associated with the game. It is merely a statement that says that EA is not responsible for the content of the website. For example, if you download something from this website that ruins your game, burns up your computer, or causes you any other damage, EA is not responsible for it. That is all that statement means.

Quote:
Game content and materials are copyrighted by Electronic Arts.

Precisely. And the game content referred to includes ALL player (third party creator) made content. As I said previously, EA owns everything anyone has made for this game.
Quote:
But fruit of our labour are still ours. And no one can grab it or claim as their own!

False.
EA certainly can, if they wanted to. EA could take whatever they wanted from any of the thousands of items that have been made by players and sell it at their website, or put it on a CD and sell it, with no compensation or even a "Thank you" to those players. Would they ever actually do that? Of course not, because it would mean bad publicity, but that doesn't mean they don't have a right to do it.
And frankly, so could anyone else. For example, I could make a CD of various downloaded items from other creators and sell it on Ebay and there is nothing that anyone could legally do to prevent it. Why haven't I or anyone else done this? Again, because EA hold all copyrights, and if someone made the material that is on my CD available for free, which they most certainly would, there is nothing I could do about it because I do not have copyrights to the material. So I would be wasting my time and money with such a project.
Even if I removed all my Lots from the SimFileShare site where they are currently available for free and tried selling them on a CD it wouldn't work in the long run because as soon as I sold a couple of the CD's, the Lots would appear at various websites as free downloads. There is nothing I could do about it because I do not have copyrights to those Lots, only EA does.
So again, someone explain to me how all of these "Policies" that people are always fretting about are valid and enforceable? They are not, because only EA has copyrights on stuff made for this game. Period.

The "fruit of your labor", Victor, is the enjoyment you get from creating the item and from sharing the item with other players. It DOES NOT include copyrights that allow you to determine how the item is used by other players.

I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand.
Scholar
#2110 Old 3rd Dec 2021 at 7:42 PM Last edited by Victor_tor : 3rd Dec 2021 at 9:33 PM.
Actually being old fart here at MTS I remember creators who had a strong point about OWN their creations. Where they were ended? Well. For example Adele was exhaused when fighting with her fans. Buggybooze disappeared with total wipe out of her creations from MTS. The reason is same.

I mean it is ok for someone even to have the possibility of such things to happen. I prefer not even to have such possibilities at all.

That's why my creations are free for everyone.

That's my point of safety and freedom I gave to other simmers. It helps me not to burn out and worry about someone will create something wrong with my creations. Do whatever you want. I will not stalking players who go against my guidelines.

Maybe my talk is gibberish. But my actions may follow your idea of creating for joy with no policies, Scaryrob.

Here you can see more of my creations and conversions for sims 3. ;) I`ll glad to see your comments in.
 
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