It's discouraging to see the minimal support for this project (at this time £245 pledged of £35,000 goal).

I wonder whether La Vida would have done better financially if they had spent more time talking about the project on MTS before going to Kickstarter? Would we be more likely to support Inge than someone that we don't know? Would we be more likely to support someone who had discussed features first?

Does anyone know this person? Do they have any proven track record with the Sims? Is there a feature list anywhere, or even a vision statement?

I agree with Mootilda. I'd be more likely to support the project if the creator had come to discuss it on here first. I'm disappointed that he hasn't come back since his first and only post.

I'm sure a lot of us would be more than happy to provide feedback.

Well like I say, it's safe. If it doesn't make the target we all get to keep our money. If it does, then we may be onto a winner that makes it worth it.

I still think it's important for Mike Hibbert to come back to respond to feedback and garner interest.

Honestly, I think it would be better for Mike Hibbert to create his own forums on his own nice website than come here. This game is awfully close to the Sims and while it might be different enough to not cause an issue, I would rather he not draw EA's attention.

Besides, a game developer needs his own site and forums. He needs to develop his own base, not come to the fan forums of a competing game to get support. Letting us know about the Kickstarter campaign here was a great idea but discussing his development here and garnering opinions and support is not, imho. There is NO WAY he can compete with The Sims games made by EA and the folks here are brutal. They will make him feel inadequate and basically undermine his project. Sorry folks, but your expectations for EA are high (not unwarranted though for a big company). A small Indie company needs encouragement, not a bunch of disgruntled Sims players telling them what they should or should not put in their game. The chance of the indie game violating EA's copyright would go up exponentially.

I remember working on a game where lots of folks came on and wanted all those features they didn't have in other games, like height sliders, slow dancing, etc. which honestly would be a pain in the neck in a multi-player game that was NOT a sims game. There were times I was in tears just because of beating people gave us for "not making my dream game!". I have a tougher skin now.

Did you read the entire project page?

The goal for this game is to have the people you control be involved in much more interesting, more long term goals rather than just fulfilling their basic physical needs. Apparently among these are running for president, becoming a nun and creating your own convent, etc. This goes far beyond the lack of variety and constant repetition that Sims 3 Opportunities are all about.

Another thing listed is that you can control multiple dudes at one time. The way it's written, it's implying that rather than switching between control of multiple Sims a la the sims games, you'll actually be in control of both at the same time. Wonder how that'll work.

What really differentiates it from the Sims 3 and 4 base games is that you should be able to own multiple homes at once; and theres more advanced forms of sickness with a range of treatments that don't magically get fixed, require actual expensive treament, and can be deadly. Also read something interesting that they might actually take the simulation to environments besides the typical suburban neighborhood or cliche big city.

So, as Inge said, this is looking more like a strategy type deal than it is a social simulation.

The point is: there is no website. There is no feature list. There is no vision statement. There is nowhere I can go to learn more about the game. There is nowhere where I can see an estimated budget. There's nowhere to learn about this person's history of writing and releasing games.

All that I see is a minimal Kickstarter page and a youtube video. I believe that this may be one of the big reasons why the project is not being funded. In two days, there hasn't been one new backer. Why? Because there isn't enough information to convince people that the project is anything other than a money-sink.

I agree. I believe I said that he wasn't ready to put this on Kickstarter. I wouldn't donate to a game that had so little information. I don't know this guy but my impression is that this is a kid who is playing with an engine like Unity or Torque, not someone who can really develop games. This may be wrong, but this is the impression he gives.

I think he might be legit, but the marketing is bad. The word dude and dudette is making me ill. Character would have been better like somebody suggested.
I guess this could be a great game but I wonder how much does this man play the sims. If he plans on stealing EA's customers with his game, he needs to play sims like there is no tomorrow, otherwise how he will know what makes this game great? It will be just like EA, putting features you think people will like because it's "hot" right now, instead of features people want.

I don't think having a glossy website would do anything to reassure me. I once nearly had work done on my house by a builder with professional looking website, plenty of recommendations that could be googled, and a reassuring guy in smart clothes to measure up and do the quote. Fortunately his own change of luck prevented us getting to the stage of paying a deposit, when it turned out he was a useless builder but very good at publicity - he'd even made multiple internet accounts in order to post his own recommendations in all manner of obscure DIY forums. On one site his accounts got banned and the admin there told us all the posts had come from on computer.

Yes, the website is only part of the problem.

It is too bad Kickstarter doesn't have requirements in place before you can post there. I imagine it has some, but not enough to make investors feel safe. Sadly, now days it seems like it is bigger companies who use crowd funding successfully instead of the smaller indie companies. Sort of defeats the purpose of Kickstarter in my humble opinion. I only donate to small companies and I don't donate unless they seem to know what they are doing.

There is a risk backing any business, even your own. The idea is to only offer the amount you can afford to lose. Which I guess is similar to what one could afford to spend on the lottery or football pools each year. I thought it was worth the gamble even if only to make EA take notice. But it seems EA can go on being confident over The Sims series for a little while longer yet

Good point. A somewhat sad one, but good nonetheless.

I just wanted to ask a question. I don't want to be annoying everyone, because I know I reply extra late to forums with barely-relevant things sometimes. (like I did yesterday).

But I was just wondering if it's actually feasibly possible for ANY company to rival the Sims series at this point in the game. It just seems like, no matter what they hopped on board with or when, it would be way too late--anything they did would look like copying since there's already a major franchise underway. So, what would a company have to do in order to really be Not-Sims and still a life simulation?

They may not be able to rival but could target a niche occupied by simulation fans, which is increasingly being abandoned by The Sims

Exactly. Well ... kind of.

Yes, I read the La Vida page, but I'm wondering if Mr. Hibbert actually played Sims 2 or 3 for an extended period of time. I'm presuming the Sims market is one of the big markets he's seeking.

Yes, I read about how your character can run for president or run a convent. And I admit that the highest you can go in Sims 2 is Mayor. But using certain mods, build downloads and clothing downloaded from various sites (though nowadays, many clergypeople wear street clothes for everyday wear), you can make some sort of convent, temple, etc.

I know the game may allow you to control many people at one time. But the site isn't clear as to how. A feature such as "Everybody dance now!" on a menu? And I don't find going back to the avatars and clicking on actions for several of them particularly difficult. Freeze the screen, click, resume. Or if you want to control an "outsider" use a selector mod and select them (but stay away from Mrs. C. and the Corruption Crew!)

It might be nice to own multiple houses at once, though theoretically, you can KIND of do that with BV (Sims 2 ... but Sims 3-ers, I'll play nice in your forum ) .... buy a vacation house in all three resort areas. But you can also create a Sim "maid" or "gardener" or make a servo robot and have them "run" the house while the "owner" is away. Then when you're ready, go to the house, use a selector mod for the family members and you have a temporary "second home".

And my problem is I don't want my Sims to get sick and die. I must have the happiest elders in the Sims community because they live to 200 without being sick. I kill my Sims reluctantly. (Though since I reset, once they go, EVERYONE goes!) If only I can do this in the real world! (Not the resetting ... the longevity.) I actually dislike killing Sims unless they're corrupted and it's the only way to go.

EA may be the bane of our existence sometimes, but I'll write this one flattering bit about the company ... as deplorable as the execs are, for us Simmers, our Sims game of choice can be a freakin' drug. Once again, writing for Sims 2, but I believe it's the same with Sims 3 addicts ... so much of what the game lacks, I can solve with mods or just my imagination. I've learned to work around many limitations. They may irritate me, but thanks to modders, I can somehow get a reasonable facsimile of what I'm imagining.

I guess that's kind of what I meant by a new niche or an attitude. We're dealing with players whose characters can be magical if we choose. Our characters can go on vacation, have pets, run businesses, model fashions, live in schools or prisons or apartments, go to nightclubs, OWN nightclubs. We're used to oodles of clothes and furniture. Again, thanks in great part to indie modders, we've been spoiled. Mr. Hibbert has a tough order to fill if he is trying to drum up interest to the point of investment. Not impossible ... just tough.

And I am totally ignorant of these things, but what is the difference between Kickstarter and GoFundMe? Wouldn't the latter have been better in this case, since whatever money is raised to a point on GoFundMe, Mr. Hibbert keeps? I don't know. Honestly.

And might he be over-reaching? Would it be better to work on the easiest platform and if that is successful, move on to other platforms? For instance .... I dunno ... start with a phone or FB app (though the latter aren't doing as well as they used to be) and if the response is positive, move on to console, then PC? Or whichever platform takes the least amount of cash to develop? Once again. I really don't know.

Re Kudos ... I've played one of the games from this developer. Bought a copy, actually, for $10. It entertained me for a month, so it was worth the cash. But it's not quite The Sims. It's mainly static pictures and you choose certain actions.

It got cancelled. Got the email just now.

And ffs he never did come back and check for feedback. He's not connected here since he posted. So if there were like 500 of us just waiting to have a question answered before we pledged $75 each, he'd never have known!!! They might be good technically but they're never gonna make a business success of it unless they change their PR machine.

He must not have had much hope for the funding.

Did he really just ask people for money and attention, not follow up and then cancel the game? I honestly can't even... did you guys who donated get any of your money back?

thank you for the info, inge. that is a shame. i feel bad if people contributed their money to him already.

If a Kickstarter project does not meet its goal, backers are not charged. Nobody's out any money - Kickstarter projects don't go ahead with partial funding. You can receive more than you ask for, but not less.

Yeah Matrix kickstarter's kind of a cool thing, you should look around it and some of the different projects.

I know what Kickstarter is, just not the inner workings of everything. Personally, I don't donate to anything that I can't see a strong end result for, or I'd consider it a waste, even if I get the money back.

The goal alone didn't seem all that encouraging.

I have mixed emotions about this.

I admit, I feel a little disappointed. Yes, a rival to the Sims series would have been nice. But he should have concentrated on the most easiest platform to work with, chatted with those who use that platform (be it his FB profile or a forum.) Start more modestly and find his rhythm in the platform he chose. Move on to bigger things once he gets a little more capital and fine-tunes his game.

That's one reason why I supported that Kudos guy (Googles, googles) ... Cliff Harris. He has his own site where he personally addresses the bugs, listens to ideas, etc. Granted, his game was not the Sims game I hungered for. But it was good entertainment for the features, and worth the $10 for that month I enjoyed it. A movie costs less. Harris also markets his product. He appears at expos, updates his site constantly, has a very eye-appealing site. He's made a few mistakes (I wasn't too fond of the "Sims 3" game he did for FB. Very much like Kudos, only with a Sims 3 theme. Those familiar with Kudos would have been OK with it; those looking for a Sims game .... not at all.) He's learned from them and moved on.

If Mr. Hibbert is aspiring to entice us, perhaps Mr. Harris' approach might be helpful to him. Players get the impression that they are all in this together, and even their measly $10 can make a difference. And I would be even willing to bet a matchstick that there are other indie developers who follow the same approach.

Keep up the presence. Update constantly and fine-tune the game, Maybe put out a basic version on FB or phone to whet our appetite. Get some sort of press coverage. I hope Mr. HIbbert doesn't give up. His game had some potential.

Apropos of this thread, the following story ran in the NY Times today:






source: NY Times

Too bad EA doesn't pursue the strategy of that the GTA folks chose as their business model.

"if you pursue a strategy of giving consumers the highest-quality titles in the business, they will come out for what you have to sell"

Quick, someone print up hundreds of t-shirts with this and send them off to EA...